MSD Ignition

[MichelHaak]

Hi guys!

I want to replace my old original igntion with a modern kind of ignition. LPG gas needs a better spark and I want some more horses and a better gas mileage (now 1 litre for 3 km), I heard a better igntion can help me with this. I don't know exectly what I need for my Buick but I just want a good ignition with better performance but not too expensive and not tooo racy. I was thinking about mallory or msd. Can you guys tell me what I need to buy (plugg and play rotor?, coil, sparkwires, ignition box?) and where to buy. i can order at Summit via another dutch guy who wants to put a big order at summit.

[centurion 455 ragtop]

Michel

You may want to first replace the points distributer with an General Motors HEI distributor. You can find them on e-bay. No need to get anthing high performance. You would just need a good rebuilt standard unit, just replace the standard coil pack with a MSD coil. You will have to change over the ignition wires as the points style will not fit. If you already have an HEI installed then get a HP coil for it. On the HEI the coil sits ontop of the distributor. Just google it and you can get an idea what it looks like. And you will have to get one that is for a Buick. I would think maybe you can find a good used one locally. If you find one make sure its not from a 350 engine. Otherwise you will have to change the distributor gear.

As for a better ignition system maybe a MSD 6A unit. It is pretty simple to install and will not empty your wallet getting one. You may be able to find one on e-bay too. But be carefull as buying electronics used can be tricky.Summit sells them new for $184.
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+115+306078&D=306078

Both the HEI unit with an aftermarket coil and a MSD 6A unit should give you better gas mileage and performance.

With my 73 Centurion I replaced the points distributor with the HEI. Just a stock rebuild unit with an aftermarket coil and pick up. I didn't bother getting a MSD unit. As for mileage if I am not heavy on the gas I get 17 mpg on the highway with the ac going, I should mention I have 2.71 rear end gears. As for towing...well its like 9-10 mpg and if I use the ac while towing...:Dou: you don't even want to know...its terrible.

[Smartin]

Crane XR-i points conversion kit!! Looks stock, but delivers a punch. Easy install, too.

I ran one in my convertible, and now run one in the Coupe. I love it!

[MichelHaak]

Well ok, you got me alot further. So it can be cheaper then I thought!

Adam: do I need a better coil with that set?

Rick: Do I need something like this you say?

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=PRO%2D67089&N=700+4294925143+4294908256+4294925079+115&autoview=sku


By the way, does anyone can tell me what a ignition systems does like the msd 6. Is it extra or does it replaces a standard thing?

[centurion 455 ragtop]

I like Adam's idea. :coffee: A bit easier to install and most likely cheaper in cost too. No changing of the distributor or wires.

I forgot I use to have the Pertronics conversion kit. It fit inside the points distributor. But I had to say I did not like the Pertronics. I had to always turn the key ignition on for about 5-6 seconds before starting her up, otherwise it won't start. Heard pros and cons with Pertronics, mine is a con.

As for other units, Adam seems to have the right choice on that.

[Smartin]

Yes, an MSD Blaster 8202 coil is what I was recommended to use with the Crane ignition.

[MichelHaak]

So this will be the wishlist for santa claus?

MSD-8202 coil

Crane XR1-I kit

Maybe new sparkplug wires


Now only two questions to go I guess :p :

-what does the MSD 6 ignition, is it an extra for an ignition system or does a buick ignition has a box like that from factory?

-how many miles to the gallon with your setup Adam?

by the way, 17 miles to the gallon is 1 liter for 7 km's, I need more than double of that now.. oops!

[Smartin]

My gas mileage is terrible, due to the way I've set my engine up. Cam, carb, heads, intake, will all effect mileage...as well as everything else.

A properly set up ignition will help to optimize gas mileage.

I would also get a set of spriral core spark plug wires. They're expensive, but worth it.

[MichelHaak]

Something like this right

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=ACC%2D5043R&N=700+4294908256+4294840139+4294890854+4294907183+ 4294925143+4294756594+115&autoview=sku

[Smartin]

I like these...made for a big block Chevy..

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_81298_-1

These fit ok, but can be a little bit long. I had these on the convertible, and Rolf probably still has them on it.

I bought a set of Taylor wires for my Coupe, and they were the ones that you have to cut and install the ends. They fit really well that way, but the installation is difficult if you don't have the proper crimp tool.

[MichelHaak]

You can order the crane for oldsmobile, pontiac, chevy and ford. Do I need the Chevy of the Pontiac one?

[Smartin]

This is the one you want:

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_79756_-1

[Robroy]

Great stuff guys!:xyxthumbs:
Thanks for starting this thread Michel.
Also I have the stock distributor with pointers. Have been thinking about getting a rebuilt HEI from http://www.davessmallbodyheis.com/, but the cost with shipping to Europe has kind of kept me from placing that order so far.

Like Michel I’m interested in improving the gas mileage but I don’t mind if it adds a little extra power as well :Brow: . So Adam’s suggestion seems very interesting to me too.

Let’s see if I got this right; the only thing you need is this rebuilding kit http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_79756_-1
to replace the pointers in the stock distributor and this works with the standard spark plug wires as well since the distributor cap stays the same?

Replacing the stock coil with a fresh one like the http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_20470_-1
makes the ignition system upgrade complete

The total cost for these items would be a little over 100 USD plus shipping.
With the gas prices in Europe, I think we get our money back pretty quick Michel ;)

[Smartin]

Correct, Per. I would recommend getting a set of performance plug wires as well. I have Taylor 8.5mm "cut to length" wires on my Coupe.

They are very stock looking.

[MichelHaak]

Yes I guess so!

I think a new rotor is also good, I heard you need to change those things in a few years also.

No one considers an ignition box from mallory or msd?

[Smartin]

I don't know enough about them to make a recommendation. But over on the v8buick board, LARRY70GS has a lot of experience with the MSD box.

[Robroy]

Correct, Per. I would recommend getting a set of performance plug wires as well. I have Taylor 8.5mm "cut to length" wires on my Coupe.

Mine looks rather new so I was thinking on replacing them later, but you’re right, a set of fresh high performance spark plug wires would make it complete.

I was actually planning on replacing the timing chain with sprockets before doing any upgrade of the performance. I’ve heard the sprockets are made of plastic :shocked: must be one h of a strong plastic material in that case. I guess the 455 wouldn’t take any damage by the valves hitting the rods if the timing chain breaks as on a modern car engine, right?

[Robroy]

Michel,
Have you found out if JEGS ships to Europe?

[Robroy]

Michel,
Have you found out if JEGS ships to Europe?
Just found it, it seems like they charge 12 dollars for overseas shipping.

In my case the Swedish customs will add a 25% tax on the value on the merchandise as well as on the total shipping cost, they are such a pain in the :moonu:

[MichelHaak]

12 dollars is nothing.. hm an envelope is about that price?

[gr_speedy]

Hey Michel since you are deep in to it, and you Robroy check this one out. With the euro high i think you both should invest is this Fuel Injection upgrade.
http://www.affordable-fuel-injection.com/index.php?id=70&title=GM+Throttle+Body+Fuel+Injection

[MichelHaak]

Looks good, but I have an LPG gas installation built in my car. LPG is only 60 eurocents and gasoline is 1,46 euros....

[The German]

... will lower fuel consumption also !

I inflated my tires to 32 and 34 PSI and again I increased the mileage - now to only 15,8 l/100 km or 14,9 miles/gallon. On the other hand that was only the first measurement over 150 km driven on country roads, so it may be not at that level in the normal mixture of town + country + highway. To find out we have to wait for the good weather season !

BTW: I´m sure that it is not a big problem driving that higher pressure on good roads and when ensuring that the pressure is not higher at warm days; one have to look for and adjust it if necessary.
___________
Rolf

[Robroy]

Hey Michel since you are deep in to it, and you Robroy check this one out. With the euro high i think you both should invest is this Fuel Injection upgrade.
http://www.affordable-fuel-injection.com/index.php?id=70&title=GM+Throttle+Body+Fuel+Injection
Thanks for the input Gr Speedy!
Looks like a great upgrade kit, however I drive my Buick too little to get the money back in a long time even with the gas prices here; it would also be a too big step from the stock design in my taste.
On a daily driver on the other hand, it would be the perfect deal ..

[Robroy]

Looks good, but I have an LPG gas installation built in my car. LPG is only 60 eurocents and gasoline is 1,46 euros....
I wasn’t aware of that your car had been converted to propane Michel…
I know it’s very popular in Holland from a thread I started in v8-forum about propane conversion.
My car also ran on propane during the 80’s in Oregon, but was later converted back to gas. I still have the big bolts left in the trunk that was used to fasten the propane tank.

[Robroy]

I inflated my tires to 32 and 34 PSI

How much would that be in “bar”?

[MichelHaak]

2,3 bar. My car has 2,5 bar in the tires. In the Netherlands a normal car which is 1300 kg's has already 2,2 bar into them.:laugh:

[The German]

How much would that be in “bar”?

2,2 and 2,4 bar ! The Buick Club of Germany has a good link for calculate different measurements : http://www.buickclub.de/ and then "Umrechner" !
______________________
Rolf

[MichelHaak]

I asked the ignition question on a Dutch forum. The most people say, just a proper MSD distributor and no Crane XR-I set, because the precision is not good at all with a worn out original distributor...

I also 'sent Larry 70 GS a Pm about the ignition boxes. Hopeful he can gives us a good answers.

You can run an MSD ready to run distributor (build in ignition module) or a normal distributor from MSD, then you'ill need an ignition box. Ready to run is 360 dollar, then also you'ill need a good coil and good sparkwires...

[Robroy]

I asked the ignition question on a Dutch forum. The most people say, just a proper MSD distributor and no Crane XR-I set, because the precision is not good at all with a worn out original distributor...

Could be that LPG sets higher demands on the ignition than regular gas. After all, if Adam can run 13,89 on the track with this ignition equipment, its good enough for me ;)
But maybe the Crane XR-I set require a distributor not too worn to work well?

[Robroy]

2,2 and 2,4 bar !
That would be what I’m having too..

Thanks for the link Rolf!

Do you know if the distributor in your car has been renovated? Thinking on mechanical details like sprockets, bearings etc?
Think Adam mentioned that your car has the Crane XR-I set too?

[The German]

... ... Do you know if the distributor in your car has been renovated? Thinking on mechanical details like sprockets, bearings etc?
Think Adam mentioned that your car has the Crane XR-I set too?

When Adam had the car at ebay he wrote : " ... The carburetor and distributor were built by John Osborne Performance, and are top notch! The distributor was converted to a small body HEI unit that doesn't miss a beat, and is stock appearing - no big ugly in-cap coils. ... ". I don´t know whether it has the Crane XR-I set too. And at this time I can´t go to look for; so I guess Adam will give us the answer faster ... .
___________
Rolf

[MichelHaak]

Hi guys!

On the dutch forum a riviera 455 owner gave me an offer for this set:

brandnew HEI igntion
MSD HEI coil (42.000 Volts)
MSD High output module (50 percent higher coil drive currents than the stock module with rev limiter).

Looks interesting?

[MichelHaak]

Here is a reply from larry, adam was talking about:

Originally Posted by Centurion Mike

Hi Larry,

I heard from Adam Martin (71 Centurion) that you are one of the guys who can tell much about ignitions. I have a 455 Centurion (on lpg gas) and I want to replace my original ignition with something betters for an improved fuel usage and better performance. I would like to buy a complete new distributor but what can I buy best? MSD/Mallory or can it be cheaper? I would also like to know what an MSD 6 ignition box does, some cars have them installed but what extra's does it have? Can you only install an ignition box on an MSD or Mallory distributor or also on a standard Hei?

With kind regards,
Michel Haak
the Netherlands


Michel,
An MSD ignition is a CD (Capacitative Discharge) Ignition. The box steps up the 12 volt battery voltage to about 450 volts and stores the energy in large capacitors. At the proper time, when triggered, it dumps the 450 volts into the coil. This results in several sparks of increased intensity, over 20* of crankshaft rotation. It will fire larger spark plug gaps and keep plugs cleaner with richer fuel mixtures. You can trigger an MSD 6AL with a points distributor, or GM HEI, or most aftermarket point conversion distributors. Hope that helps.

[Robroy]

On the dutch forum a riviera 455 owner gave me an offer for this set:

brandnew HEI igntion
MSD HEI coil (42.000 Volts)
MSD High output module (50 percent higher coil drive currents than the stock module with rev limiter).

Looks interesting?
How much is he asking for it?

I’ve checked some Swedish forums and they all seem to be into the MSD distributor solution just like the Dutch guys. http://www.msdignition.com/dist_31.htm
It’s probably great; it just seems a little overkill to install on an untouched 130k miles stock engine like mine.

A used HEI-distributor would work too if you can live with the non-stock look on the distributor cap, cheaper than the MSD distributor anyway.

I’m still hooked on the thought of installing the Crane XR-i points conversion kit together with a fresh coil and spark plug wires. Question remains however if this would work well in a stock distributor with 130k miles on it?::confused:

[MichelHaak]

In your case I would do that I guess. I don't care if it's stock or not, if it looks good it's ok for me. :laugh:

I think an MSD or Mallory is the best solution after all... They will last for a long long time and are very accurate, many parts availible and high performance (which I think I need for LPG).


If the guy isn't asking too much I will just buy it, otherwise I will wait till March next year and just save money for the MSD ready to run + coil + spark plug wires.

[The German]

[QUOTE=The German;3501] ... ... I don´t know whether it has the Crane XR-I set too. ... ... ./QUOTE]

Per, yesterday evening I looked under the hood but couldn´t see anything of that Crane XR-I set and because we had cold strong wind partly coming through the gaps of the western door of my garage leaving it through the eastern door gaps I didn´t look into the distributor but wrote a question-email to Adam; here is his answer : "Yes, your car has the Crane unit installed in the place where the points should be, inside the distributor. The plus, wires, and coil are all what they should be. No need to install anything else for the ignition. :) "

My car is really a good one. - Thanks to you, Adam !!! :xyxthumbs:
__________________
Rolf

[centurion 455 ragtop]

Guys

Something to think about here. Your combination and how much you drive your Buick and what do you most do with it, cruises, race it, or a daily driver.

And cost.

Your goal is mainly better gas mileage with maybe a bi-product of better horsepower.

My Centurion I try to squeeze the most out of her as I tow and the gas mileage is under 10 mpg when towing. I had gone 2 of the 3 following routes and both worked.

The electronic ignition convertion kit: This is by far the cheapest as it fits inside your existing distributor and nothing else changes. It can be extremely reliable. Most important buy an extra module and keep it in your glove box in case the one in the car fails and your away from home. My unit did get me decent gas mileage no complaints other than the Brand I had I did not like it. But there are many other brands. Adam had used it and also hand it working fine. MSD 6a unit or something equivilant is an option but again can be pricey and isn't really needed.

The other route is switching to an HEI distributor setup. A little more money if you buy a good used GM distributor, and seperately you would have to buy a new cap, coil, wires and module/pick up available almost anywhere. To buy a new distributor from MSD is costly and not recommended in this case. I would search the boards or in your general area to get a good used one for a low price. A seperate MSD 6a unit or something equivilant is an option but again can be pricey. I ended up going this route finding a good used distributor and bought the parts from a local auto parts store. If you prefer performance first on your list well you can still do it with a HEI unit along with all the high performance parts $$$ and an MSD unit.

I get respectable gas mileage, and performance is now slightly better.

The first two will improve gas mileage and give you a slight increase in horsepower if properly tuned. THe third may do the same but performance is first.

Other factor here guys is your carburator (spelling?). Is it old and dirty, or fairly new and tuned properly. You can have the most efficient ignition system but a fouling carb will make you lose it all. Also you have to consider the timing on your car which also can effect gas mileage.

Hope this helps.

[Robroy]

Per, yesterday evening I looked under the hood but couldn´t see anything of that Crane XR-I set and because we had cold strong wind partly coming through....
Really appreciate that you went out in our windy garage to check this for me :)

I’ve been checking the v8-forum regarding this subject too and there seem to be a lot of options on the aftermarket ignition front and no really obvious solutions. Some got burned coils etc when upgrading, guess they didn’t do it right or just had bad luck with their components?:confused:
Anyway, I think I’ll go for Adams recommendation with the “Crane Cams XR-I Points To Electronic Ignition” combined with a fresh coil and ignition cables as a first step.
Later on I might have my distributor checked by a specialist for replacing mechanical parts like springs and bearings etc as a second step.

Replacing the timing chain with sprockets is also on the list which will improve the exactness on the timing.

[MichelHaak]

I have decided too now.

Because my car runs on LPG, I need a really good spark. Therefore I will wait a couple of months and I will buy an MSD distributor + 6AL ignition box + MSD blaster 2 coil + the best spark plug wires.

In the Netherlands they advised this setup for hi performance and also a for LPG cars. A 400 CUI lincoln driver has 3 lincolns, the cars on LPG and HEI ignition are running 1 litre for 4 km's and the one with the MSD setup like above has a fuel consumption of 1 litre for every 6 km's...

Because the MSD 6AL gives alot of sparks instead of one under the 3000 rpm. this is what I need for LPG. The carburator don't care for LPG, maybe I need to check the LPG mixer if it's the right one for my setup.

[The German]

Michel, could you post a picture of your LPG mixer and its mechanic ?

And as I´m informed LPG has a higher burning temperature than normal fuel; so it could be necessary to keep an sharp eye on the oil temp. - specially when driving on hot summer days. Normal fuel has an effect of oil for the valves which the LPG does not have. Sometimes I heard of a special seperate system that brings a liqid to the valves to avoid more wear on them. Is that necessary to the 455-cui-motor too?
_________________
Rolf

[MichelHaak]

here are some recent pictures of my engine bay, sorry for the mess ... :error:



When they install LPG, they normallky also install hardened valve sittings (or whatever they are called in the states). The stuff you mean is flashlube which act like a lead replacer for the valves. I'm not aware about tempurature... Only thing I know is that LPG is cold as hell when it flows into normal air. That's why you need a evaporator (mine is new).

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/Michelhaak/DSC_2753.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/Michelhaak/DSC_2754.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/Michelhaak/DSC_2759_edited-1.jpg

Could someone tell me what's on this plate? I'm searching for the original paint code.

[73 Centurion]

I have a Pertronix unit and I've had no trouble with it. I would recommend anyone considering one replace the stock resistor wire with a normal wire. The resistor wire lowers the voltage to help the points survive, since you're removing the points you don't need this restriction.

Starting from stock here's what I would recommend.
1) New points, cap, rotor wires and plugs.

2) Check the timing, if it fluctuates your timing chain or distributor might be worn and no amount of electronics will make it right.

Once the stock system is solid, then begin the upgrades.

3a) If your building a car for racing go straight to an MSD system. You'll likely end up with one eventually. The amount of improvement on a street car might not be worth the price.

3b) If your car is for the street I would recommend getting rid of the points first Crane or Pertronix (or others). This lets you move the ignition system from 9v up to14.5v by removing that resistor wire. This is a good base for future upgrades.

4) Follow some of the great articles on changing the advance curve. You can make huge improvements in power and mileage by getting the advance in early. But you've got to spend some time fiddling with it so it doesn't ping. This is where the biggest improvements can be made in the ignition system. A stock system with a proper advance curve will outperform an MSD with a bad curve.

5) If you still want more, and we are into diminishing returns here, you can add MSD.

The HEI ignitions are better than stock but the advance curve is worse and changing it is harder. So it's an improvement but a bit of a dead end. If it's good enough that's fine, if you think you'll be tinkering later you'd be better with the stock distributor.

The distributors job is to provide the spark at the right time. The size of the spark has a small impact on performance compared to the timing of the spark. The proper advance curve depends on your engine, how you drive, where you drive and other factors. The factory sets it very conservatively so it is idiot proof. The only way to approach the ideal curve for you is to experiment. Change something and drive it for a while and repeat. That's why I recommend the steps above. It gets you to the place were the biggest improvements can be found if you're willing to play with it.

That's one opinion, your mileage may vary. :)

John

[The German]

Thanks, Michel, for the pics.

The evaporator is not bigger than used in smaller cars. In Germany sometimes we have the problem that the historic title is not given to a car if the parts of such a system are too dominant.

With specially prepared valves you will have no problems, but in spite of that I would be careful of course.

I have no answer regarding your paint code question; hope the specialtists for that will give it to you. For my car there is a note about the color code in the service manual. Perhaps you could find it in the 1972 manual too(?)!
___________________
Rolf

[Smartin]

Rolf - your valves already have hardened seats installed.

[The German]

Rolf - your valves already have hardened seats installed.

Super ! :xyxthumbs: I guess there was not a month without some new information about my car, Adam, and most of them were good news !
(BTW : I found a method to repair the rubber at the ball joints at the front axle without taking them out ! But I have not done the work - too cold for - and I will write about it with some pictures after it´s repaired.)

Thanks for your info. !
___________
Rolf

[Robroy]

I have a Pertronix unit and I've had no trouble with it................
Thanks John for this great post!
Points, cap, rotor wires and plugs looks fresh and fairly new on my engine so I think I go ahead and check the timing with a stroboscope lamp as you suggest as step 2.
How much would be considered normal fluctuation? Quarter of an inch maybe?

When I was going through a car mechanic education in the late 70’s, the teacher told us to put the advance as early as possible to gain power as well as a good mileage. His method was to set the timing so that the engine just was on the edge to diesel (I think this is what you call ping?) when pushing the gas pedal rapidly to the bottom.
I think that’s just what you are suggesting too, to find that point, right?:)

As I said in the other posts I’m thinking on replacing the timing chain with sprockets and if needed let a specialist go over and check the distributor for mechanical wear.
Do you know if a broken timing chain would mean any damage on a 455?
Thinking on valves colliding with the rods:bawl:

[Robroy]

Rolf - your valves already have hardened seats installed.
That goes for all 455’s right?

[Robroy]

Guys

Something to think about here. Your combination and how much you drive your Buick and what do you most do with it, cruises, race it, or a daily driver.

And cost.

Your goal is mainly better gas mileage with maybe a bi-product of better horsepower.

My Centurion I try to squeeze the most out of her as I tow and the gas mileage is under 10 mpg when towing. I had gone 2 of the 3 following routes and both worked.

The electronic ignition convertion kit: This is by far the cheapest as it fits inside your existing distributor and nothing else changes. It can be extremely reliable. Most important buy an extra module and keep it in your glove box in case the one in the car fails and your away from home. My unit did get me decent gas mileage no complaints other than the Brand I had I did not like it. But there are many other brands. Adam had used it and also hand it working fine. MSD 6a unit or something equivilant is an option but again can be pricey and isn't really needed.

The other route is switching to an HEI distributor setup. A little more money if you buy a good used GM distributor, and seperately you would have to buy a new cap, coil, wires and module/pick up available almost anywhere. To buy a new distributor from MSD is costly and not recommended in this case. I would search the boards or in your general area to get a good used one for a low price. A seperate MSD 6a unit or something equivilant is an option but again can be pricey. I ended up going this route finding a good used distributor and bought the parts from a local auto parts store. If you prefer performance first on your list well you can still do it with a HEI unit along with all the high performance parts $$$ and an MSD unit.

I get respectable gas mileage, and performance is now slightly better.

The first two will improve gas mileage and give you a slight increase in horsepower if properly tuned. THe third may do the same but performance is first.

Other factor here guys is your carburator (spelling?). Is it old and dirty, or fairly new and tuned properly. You can have the most efficient ignition system but a fouling carb will make you lose it all. Also you have to consider the timing on your car which also can effect gas mileage.

Hope this helps.

Hey Rick,
Somehow I missed this post earlier and got to read it today, very clear and good info me thinks:xyxthumbs: .

This thread contains all lot of good stuff on this subject.
Thanks everyone for sharing your experience! :beers: And thanks Michel for starting it! :beers:

[The German]

Originally Posted by Smartin :
Rolf - your valves already have hardened seats installed.

That goes for all 455’s right?

I don´t know the answer, Per, but hope there is anyone out who could give it !
Only what I know from Adam is that my "heads were rebuilt after minor coolant leak from the head gasket. These are Stage1 >Big Valve< heads, original to this car. It has the Riv GS optional engine that included these heads, slightly hoter cam, and some other things that are really irrelevant as far as performance goes." Perhaps they were hardened before reinstalling (?).

Anyway; - Adam, do you know an answer to Per´s question ?
____________________
Rolf

[Robroy]

Since we can run unleaded, the valve seats should be hardened…:confused2:

[Smartin]

Starting in late 71 model year, the factory installed hardened seats in their heads.

[Robroy]

Checked my timing today with a timing light and it was 4* BTDC, just what the book say it should be. The mark seemed to be very steady and not fluctuating which should indicate that the distributor as well as the timing chain are pretty ok and not too worn :) .
Those of you that are running stock 455’s, what timing do you usually set? Guess you can go higher than 4*?
Also what octane are you running?

[Smartin]

You can go as high as you can without the engine pinging.

Your TOTAL advance is what you really should look for, though.

Check out this thread:

http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=63475&highlight=power+timing

[Robroy]

I’ll check it out, Thanks Adam!

How about the fuel octane? We typically run 95 and 98 here...

[Smartin]

That's higher than we run here. It's typically no higher than 93 if we're lucky. Many places have gone to 91. Occasionally, I find Sunoco 94, but it's rare.

You could get away with more timing with higher octane, but as you keep increasing initial timing, performance will start to decrease.

[Robroy]

I bought a set of Taylor wires for my Coupe, and they were the ones that you have to cut and install the ends. They fit really well that way, but the installation is difficult if you don't have the proper crimp tool.
Adam,
I hate to bother you about this again, but did you get those Taylor wires at JEGS? And if so do you happen to have the art-number on them? JEGS have a LOT to choose from..
Also do these require a special tool to be cut? I normally use the kind on the pict below

I have a new-looking set of AC Delco Premium 7mm currently on, guess they would be to weak for the MSD Blaster 8202 coil and Crane XR-i points conversion kit?

[The German]

... ... I inflated my tires to 32 and 34 PSI and again I increased the mileage - now to only 15,8 l/100 km or 14,9 miles/gallon. On the other hand that was only the first measurement over 150 km driven on country roads, so it may be not at that level in the normal mixture of town + country + highway. To find out we have to wait for the good weather season ! ... ... Rolf

Today we had some sunshine and temperature came up to 12°C (53,6°F); so I took the car out of the garage and drove through the country north of the industrial Ruhr area and enjoyed the car while listening to French chansons - wonderful. :cool:
Before storing the car the garage again I gased it up and couldn´t trust my eyes first: only 18,6 mpG or 12,7 l/100 km !! This time I drove with 35 PSI in all tires (my car storage pressure) and only on country roads with only few stops. I´m really cuious what mileage I´ll get when driving the normal mixture of town + country + highway in summer with the slightly higher than normal pressure of 32 and 34 PSI. It seems as if the pressure has a great influence on the mileage of these cars. :rolleyes:
______________
Rolf

[Smartin]

Per, here are the wires:

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_214338_-1

Here is the crimp tool:

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_92766_-1

[Robroy]

Before storing the car the garage again I gased it up and couldn´t trust my eyes first: only 18,6 mpG or 12,7 l/100 km !!
Rolf,
That’s a really good milage considering the cars weight and engine size. I used to be in that area with my small block cars.
Tire pressure definitely has an impact on the fuel consumption



Per, here are the wires:

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_214338_-1

Here is the crimp tool:

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10002_92766_-1
Thanks Adam!