Restoration plan

[speedracer]

I have owned this Centurion since 1986. It currently has 180,000 miles. Over the years, many mechanical problems have been repaired. However, I have not made any attempt to restore the body or interior. At the current time, my car has the following issues.

1) Rusted rear truck lid.
2) Rusted hood on the front
3) Rusted rear quarter pannels from the top draining into the pannels.
4) Rusted floorpans in the rear from leaking top.
5) Poor condition original interior due to extreme use.
6) 1 of the 4 windows still working the other do not work due to motor problems, track problems, and switch problems
7) AC not working due to compressor and hoses.
8) Heater not working due to bad heater core.
9) Top working but needs new vinyl top, current one is ripped.
10) Carpet was brown but faded to green.
11) radio not working
12) Various door panels faded, ripped, and look un-repairable.
13) Insulation under hood destroyed.
14) Carpet in Trunk destroyed
15) Front bumper is light rusted
16) Back bumper has been hit twice, bent beyond repair, Tail lights broken, back-up covers broken.
17 ) Dash lights not working.

Ok, that is the basic list of cosmetic problems.

In addition, the engine has 180,000 and has not been restored. I had the transmission rebuilt about 5 years ago and it is in good shape.

Because of the rust problems, I have decided the most cost effective way to restore the car is to find a donor car and then cut and paste the needed parts. I am sure that the cost of this restoration attempt will exceed the values of the restored car, Consequently, I am focused on moderate expectations and low to moderate cost.

My basic plan is as follows.

1) Remove interior, cut our rusted floor pans and weld in floor pans from donor car.
2) Remove and replace rear quarter panels
3) Remove and replace trunk and hood.
4) Remove and replace rear bumper.
5) Fix window guides and electric motors and switches.
6) Fix heater core.
7) Cut and paste interior (Original color) from Donor car as needed and recover seats. Install 3 point seat belt.
8) Replace carpet.- brown
9) Replace top - tan
10) Sand and paint car to original color.

With any left over funds. Address the following issues.
- Repair AC and heater
- Repair suspension and brakes
- Rebuild or replace engine w electronic ignition.

The goal for this car is to bring it back to respectable street condition. I intend to have my son use this car as his daily driver when he turns 16 in three years. The key elements for your proposal are as follows.

1) Are you interested in this project,
2) Are you willing to have the donor car shipped to your location in the next two weeks.
3) What is your hourly shop rate.
4) Based on previous experience what is your estimated project cost. ( how long will it take to perform the requested work?)
5) Is my plan reasonable? Do you have any recommendations?
6) My current budget is in the range of $6000-$8000

[73 Centurion]

Hi Speedracer,

It looks like your message was aimed at a particular person, but I thought I'd jump in anyway.

Your budget does not appear to be sufficient for your goals. The body work and paint could easily consume more than your budget.

I suspect this car has sentimental value and a price can't be put on that. But if you want a reasonable daily driver for your son the best way to get there with your budget is to look for a different Centurion in better shape. $8k should get you a pretty solid car.

I would suggest you get the nicest body your budget allows and fix the mechanicals as you go.

If you're willing to do a lot of the work you can probably get your Centurion into working fashion. The key is going to be finding a rust free 2 door hardtop LeSabre to use for parts.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.

John

[speedracer]

Thanks John I know what your saying is true. It would be more economical to dump the current car and find another one. However, I hope that with modest expectations I can make my plan work. I posted what I plan to send to restoration people to see if they will take on the project. I guessed that some on this site have gone though this process and am looking for al little help on what to ask for at this point in the project.

I guess you are recommending a bigger budget. How much bigger is realistic?????

[speedracer]

Please do not look at these pictures if you are offended by Buicks in rough condtion.

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=194

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=199

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=198

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=197

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=196

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=194

[speedracer]

http://www.buickcenturion.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=18&pictureid=195

[speedracer]

I know its painful to look at but that is my current condition.,,,,,

[speedracer]

One of my favorite books to read to my son was the Velveteen Rabbit.

If I place my Buick by the trash fire will it become real?????

[Austrian455]

Ohh man, that´s rust.
I had to go through all this on my car too.
Only difference is that my car had no rust on the floor pans, trunk doors, trunk, hood...
The only place we had to do some welding was on lower rear quarter panel in front of the wheels. There I had hole with about 1 inch in diameter on both sides.
Replacing the vinyl top, body work and painting (doors out, hood and trunk off, all new weatherstriping....) was about 8000 dollars. But that was in Europe, I think you should be able to get this done cheaper in the US.

[speedracer]

How did you fix the rear quarter pannel?

[Austrian455]

It wasn´t very bad. As you can see on the pics the car had very little rust.
We fabricated all the small pieces sheet metal we needed to weld in.

Unbelieveable that the car was a nativ New Yorker it´s whole live.
orig. paint on the pics you see.

[centurion 455 ragtop]

My advise to you as follows:

Just keep the motivation, by reading up on how things are done and research the work.

Be realistic with your end game. Some things are just better left for those who know how to do it. Another words you may try to do it yourself and end up doing it twice, costing you more in the end.

Search E-Bay, it is a necessary evil. If you spot something KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT, Go to church and say a prayer, and dive in and hope you win that bid. If you lose it, then continue on your search or as I did I located a donor car and picked it clean for the parts.

Big one is MONEY. Plan each part of the project.

Take your time to do each job correctly.

Be patient and ask plenty of questions.

Back in 1997 after wanting a Centurion convertible 455 for many years I had finally found one that was in bad shape, but a solid frame car that was unregistered since 1986. It was from the second owner who never registered it, during which time a tree fell across the roof. I bought it for $300 and it was a running original 455 convert. I stored it for about a year reading up on what I needed and then sold my 1973 restored Riviera GS. (which I regret now on doing) I rolled the money from that sale into the Centurion. By the start of 1999 I was done. I attached before and after shots. Now some 10 years later she is showing wear with nicks a few scratches and the wear on the top. But I did restore it to be a reliable family cruiser. Plus I tow my GS with it to various Buick events. But I do do enjoy it and thats worth it all. What did I farm out? The body work and paint, including the new top frame and skin, and I had the interior re-done. Chrome and trim and interior pieces I installed along with doing all the mechanical work, new trans, engine, suspension etc.

[Centurion717273]

Unload your current project and get a few bucks for it, add that to your $8K figure and you should be able to buy a rather nice Centurion. You are always better off starting with a good solid car - you can dump far more than $8K in yours and still not be anywhere near done. That interior alone will set you back a few grand. And in the end you will still have a car that is patched together unless done exceptionally well. Stick with a 73as you will be able to get more car for your money as they bring a few dollars less than the 71 and 72's and are more plentiful.

[centurion 455 ragtop]

Unload your current project and get a few bucks for it, add that to your $8K figure and you should be able to buy a rather nice Centurion. You are always better off starting with a good solid car - you can dump far more than $8K in yours and still not be anywhere near done. That interior alone will set you back a few grand. And in the end you will still have a car that is patched together unless done exceptionally well. Stick with a 73as you will be able to get more car for your money as they bring a few dollars less than the 71 and 72's and are more plentiful.

Kurtis you brought up a very good point. Thinking now and seeing how prices dropped a person can get a good solid Centurion that needs little to no work for that amount. You pay one price and on that same day you can enjoy it.

[Centurion717273]

Kurtis you brought up a very good point. Thinking now and seeing how prices dropped a person can get a good solid Centurion that needs little to no work for that amount. You pay one price and on that same day you can enjoy it.


Rick, you would be a good judge of cost, I bet you have FAR more than $8K bringing yours back to it's current beautiful appearance. Plus a good point is the instant enjoyment out of buying a good one. Unless someone is able to do most of the work, have unlimited access to parts it just doesn't pay to do the restoration unless the car has much sentimental value.

[speedracer]

I know that it is less expensive to get rid of the current car. I do not plan to do any of the work myself.

[speedracer]

My advise to you as follows:

Just keep the motivation, by reading up on how things are done and research the work.

Be realistic with your end game. Some things are just better left for those who know how to do it. Another words you may try to do it yourself and end up doing it twice, costing you more in the end.

Search E-Bay, it is a necessary evil. If you spot something KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT, Go to church and say a prayer, and dive in and hope you win that bid. If you lose it, then continue on your search or as I did I located a donor car and picked it clean for the parts.

Big one is MONEY. Plan each part of the project.

Take your time to do each job correctly.

Be patient and ask plenty of questions.

Back in 1997 after wanting a Centurion convertible 455 for many years I had finally found one that was in bad shape, but a solid frame car that was unregistered since 1986. It was from the second owner who never registered it, during which time a tree fell across the roof. I bought it for $300 and it was a running original 455 convert. I stored it for about a year reading up on what I needed and then sold my 1973 restored Riviera GS. (which I regret now on doing) I rolled the money from that sale into the Centurion. By the start of 1999 I was done. I attached before and after shots. Now some 10 years later she is showing wear with nicks a few scratches and the wear on the top. But I did restore it to be a reliable family cruiser. Plus I tow my GS with it to various Buick events. But I do do enjoy it and thats worth it all. What did I farm out? The body work and paint, including the new top frame and skin, and I had the interior re-done. Chrome and trim and interior pieces I installed along with doing all the mechanical work, new trans, engine, suspension etc.


Wow,

Your car is beautiful.:xyxthumbs:

[hermanrodriquez]

I'm in the middle of a restoration right now and can tell you 8K will go fast. I have a doner and it's still sucking up the money. Regardless if it's a 71,72 or 73 the Centurion is not easy to find! Looking at your car you have to do an inventory of what's really good, driver quality, and bad. Check around for a car that will make yours better or the other way around. Then decide what way is best. I'm doing this with a car my dad gave me. I was better off buying a new car (9K) and combining both. The car I bought was in good condition with some body issues. Total it's going to cost me around 17K to get the car the way I want it....and it still wont be "perfect". By the way I'm not doing any of the work either...so it costs more.:moonu:

Good luck with your decision.

[speedracer]

I am going to try to find a shop to take on the project, My expectations are modest. I have a donor car ready to buy that is a good match.

[EEE]

$8k is a lot of hours at the desk.. Do a lot of research first before you commit to this project. I think that $ should bring you a pretty nice "C", you'll just have to keep your eyes open... I'm leaning more and more towards "already done", just seems to be cheaper and easier.

[73 Centurion]

This is not a rational hobby so your decision to work on this car is no less rational than the decisions we made on our cars.

My car was a $900 lawn ornament, and a breif 18 years later it's stunning.

Keeping your expectations modest will help. There are other ways to save money.

The biggest one is to do some of the work yourself. This is not as difficult as it sounds. You could ask your son if he's willing to invest some of his time and effort. Learning and doing it together can be fun. I cherish the memories I have of working on cars with my Dad.

You can buy generic seatcovers that will suffice. Elbow grease will clean up the stained door panels. A new carpet can be found for $120. If you can unbolt the front seats it's easy to slip in. I suggest you do NOT try to unbolt the seatbelts they are notoriously difficult. Just slit the carpet and slide it over the belts. Unbolt and remove the front seats. That is required for the carpet replacement, but it also makes cleaning the interior panels much easier. It's also easier to install the covers when they are out of the car. If you unbolt the stainless trim from the seats you can reinstall it over the covers to give a bit more finished look.

You could do the cleaning, carpet replacement and seatcover installation in a weekend. It would make a HUGE difference in the car and it's a great place to start.

You can buy spray can paint (on the web) that is a perfect match for the stock paint. A little sandpaper, some elbow grease, spot putty primer and paint can fix any rust that doesn't go all the way through the metal. The first section you do will take a couple of weekends. When you get familiar with the process it will take much less time.

For the areas with rust through you can handle those repairs yourself also. I drove around for years with sheet metal pop riveted in place and covered in Bondo. You can do much the same with panel adhesives instead of pop rivets.

Wait for a sale at Maco or other cheap paint place. It's not a show quality job but it makes the car 1 color.

You could also contact the High School or local Vocational school and ask them if they are willing to use your car as a project.

You could also ask around for someone who repairs cars as a sideline or hobby. It will always take longer, but they charge less than the shop rates.

There are Buick fans all over the country. You'd be amazed at how much support they are willing to offer. They won't do the work for you, but you could find someone who's willing to mentor you and your son.

List out the projects the car needs. Pick the ones you might want to handle and ask questions on these boards. You'll get step by step instructions and tons of encouragement.

The car looks rough but one weekend spent on the interior and a cheap paint job could get you off to a flying start.

Good luck and let us know how you progress.

John

[73 Centurion]

Let's look at your list:

1) Rusted rear trunk lid.

The trunk lid is the same on any LeSabre or Centurion (2 or 4 door) from 1973. It's held on with 4 bolts. It's an easy thing to swap. Find a solid one, clean, sand and paint with a spray can.

2) Rusted hood on the front

The picture shows surface rust on one corner. This looks like it might be a sand and paint. Otherwise the Hood is the same on LeSabre and Centurions from 1973. If you found the trunk lid, perhaps you could find the hood.

3) Rusted rear quarter pannels from the top draining into the pannels.

This is very common. It also is one of the harder things to do yourself. I'd suggest you hunt around for someone to do it.

4) Rusted floorpans in the rear from leaking top.

This is also common. The floor pans are hidden under the carpet. You could try to patch these when you have built up a little confidence. Until then slip a peice of metal under the carpet so peoples feet don't hit the street. A little seam sealer will hold it in place.

5) Poor condition original interior due to extreme use.

Mr. Clean Magic Eraser Cleaning Pads are miraculous on car interiors. Replacement carpet $120, seat covers $50. The armrests also take a lot of wear. Pull the door panel off remove the pad, find someone who sews and beg them to make up covers. Or buy cheap white vinyl and spray glue and try covering them yourself. They are straight flat rectangles, not a hard shape to cover.

6) 1 of the 4 windows still working the other do not work due to motor problems, track problems, and switch problems.

Switch problems are the easiest. Find electrical contact cleaner spray that on the switch. Lightly sand the posts that plug into the back of the switch. The motors rarely wear out on these and the tracks are pretty robust. I bet most of your trouble is electrical.

7) AC not working due to compressor and hoses.

It's a convertible. A/C is nice but not essential. This can wait until the car is back in service.

8) Heater not working due to bad heater core.
Find a shade tree mechanic, this is a simple repair that is 90% labor 10% parts.

9) Top working but needs new vinyl top, current one is ripped.

Spend the money here. Find a shop with a good reputation on scissor style roofs. Buy the top they recommend. There is no cheap alternative that won't cause more harm than good.

10) Carpet was brown but faded to green.

Carpet is very easy to replace. It's simpler if you remove the front seats, but it can be done with the seats in place if you are willing to make some long slits in the carpet.

11) radio not working

You've got a Buick engine to listen to. A cheap boom box in the rear seat will suffice. I'm giving the cheapest options here.

12) Various door panels faded, ripped, and look un-repairable.
Mr. Clean Eraser pads. If that doesn't do it you can buy spray paint for vinyl that will cover up a lot of sins.

13) Insulation under hood destroyed.
Remove the remnants. Keep the plastic retainers for future use.

14) Carpet in Trunk destroyed
Remove the carpet. Convertible trunks frequently get wet so a replacement is probably not a good idea. Spray on sume truck bedliner if stuff is sliding around too much.

15) Front bumper is light rusted
Coke. Strange but true, go over the bumper with Coke (not diet, not new coke just straight Coke) and a rag and see how it looks. If you want to get more aggressive use aluminum foil. Follow either with some metal polish and it will look OK.

16) Back bumper has been hit twice, bent beyond repair, Tail lights broken, back-up covers broken.
These suckers are heavy. If you can find a replacement take it to a shop that will swap the bumpers for you. This is another area to open the purse and get a decent bumper.

17 ) Dash lights not working.

If they are all out it's probably a fuse but let's start with the easiest. Have you checked the dimmer on the headlight switch? After that the owners manual will tell you what fuse to replace.